ianstone
07-12-2010, 02:14 PM
French MPs to vote on burkha ban that could imprison men who force wives to wear them
By Mail Foreign Service (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/home/search.html?s=y&authornamef=Mail+Foreign+Service)
Last updated at 4:31 PM on 12th July 2010
France could ban burkhas by the end of September after a series of parliamentary votes was scheduled to begin.
Deputies, or members of the lower house, are tomorrow likely to approve the measure outlawing face-covering veils despite outrage among the country’s 5million Muslims.
And the could be ratified in September when Senators are almost certain to approve the ban which has received overwhelming support from voters.
http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2010/07/12/article-0-0A56D37E000005DC-511_468x339.jpg Outrage: A Muslim woman in a face-covering niqab holds her French passport
There was little resistance among lawmakers today as they debated bill that proposes to fine wearers £140 and imprison men who force their wives to put on the outfit.
But the ban could be shot down by France's constitutional watchdog or the European Court of Human Rights.
That could dampen efforts under way in other European countries toward banning the veils.
It would also be a humiliation for President Nicolas Sarkozy's conservative government, which has devoted much attention to a bill that would affect only an estimated 1,900 women in France.
The main body representing French Muslims says face-covering veils are not required by Islam and not suitable in France, but it worries that the law will stigmatize Muslims in general.
The niqab and burkha are widely seen in France as a gateway to extremism and an attack on women's rights and secularism, a central value of modern-day France. Critics say a ban is a cynical ploy to attract far-right voters.
The government has struggled - and failed, some legal observers say - to come up with a strong legal basis for a ban.
In March, France's highest administrative body, the Council of State, warned that it could be found unconstitutional. It rejected possible legal justifications one by one, including the French tradition of secularism, equality for women, human dignity and concerns about public security.
In the end, the government's central legal argument is that covering one's face doesn't square with French values.
Life in France is ‘carried out with a bare face,’ Justice Minister Michele Alliot-Marie said last week, opening debate at the National Assembly.
As legal reasoning, she invoked the notion of public policy doctrine, a country's moral and social rules.
Face-covering veils ‘call into question the idea of integration, which is founded on the acceptance of the values of our society,’ Alliot-Marie said.
The legislation would forbid face-covering Muslim veils in all public places in France, even in the street.
It calls for £140 fines or citizenship classes, or both.
The bill is also aimed at husbands and fathers who impose such veils on women and girls.
Anyone convicted of forcing someone else to wear the garb risks a year of prison and a £25,000 fine - with both those penalties doubled if the victim is a minor.
Officials have taken pains to craft language that does not single out Muslims. While the proposed legislation is colloquially referred to as the ‘anti-burkha law,’ it is officially called ‘the bill to forbid concealing one's face in public.’
It refers neither to Islam nor to veils - leading to an often surreal disconnect between the text and discussion in parliament about it. While officials insist the law against face-covering would apply to everyone, not just Muslims, they cite a host of exceptions, including masks for health reasons, for fencing, for carnivals and festivals.
Legislator Berengere Poletti, of Sarkozy's conservative party, argued that women in such garb ‘wear a sign of alienation on their faces’ and ‘must be liberated,’ even if they say the apparel is their own choice.
Communist Andre Gerin, who also supports a ban, said that ‘talking about liberty to defend the wearing of the full veil is totally cynical - for me, the full veil is a walking coffin, a muzzle.’
Socialist Jean Glavany, one of the few lawmakers to offer stinging criticism of a ban, said dwelling on questions of French identity and whether burkhas are welcome in France ‘is nothing more than the fear of those who are different, who come from abroad, who aren't like us, who don't share our values.’
He was also one of several lawmakers to question the bill's ‘judicial fragility.’
To address that widespread concern, the conservative majority has taken the unusual step of asking the Constitutional Council watchdog to examine the bill once it passes parliament - a move usually made by opponents of legislation.
Down the road, the law could face another challenge at the European Court of Human Rights in Strasbourg, where decisions are binding.
In February, the court shot down a Turkish decision that convicted dozens of people for wearing religious clothing in public.
Comments (27)
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They won't dare do it , for fear of the back lash .
- parrcent, merseyside, 12/7/2010 18:00
Click to rate (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/worldnews/article-1294099/French-MPs-vote-burkha-ban-imprison-men-force-wives-wear-them.html#) (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/worldnews/article-1294099/French-MPs-vote-burkha-ban-imprison-men-force-wives-wear-them.html#) Rating 1
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French have the guts not like our country.
- Kiran, Swindon, England, 12/7/2010 17:58
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Never thought to say it about those socialist overspenders, but on this one: Viva la France!
- Linda, Farmington, USA, 12/7/2010 17:49
Click to rate (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/worldnews/article-1294099/French-MPs-vote-burkha-ban-imprison-men-force-wives-wear-them.html#) (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/worldnews/article-1294099/French-MPs-vote-burkha-ban-imprison-men-force-wives-wear-them.html#) Rating 3
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Well done France, show the dithering British politicians the way to go, they are feared of their own shadows, but not when it comes to making money from their pathetic memoirs..Now who in their right mind would want to read such rubbish for doing nothing........
- BRONCO LINCOLN, BRITISH ISLES, 12/7/2010 17:48
Click to rate (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/worldnews/article-1294099/French-MPs-vote-burkha-ban-imprison-men-force-wives-wear-them.html#) (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/worldnews/article-1294099/French-MPs-vote-burkha-ban-imprison-men-force-wives-wear-them.html#) Rating (0)
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I fail to see how this would help matters. Men who force women to wear such things won't stop just because of a prison sentence or fine, they simply won't let their wife/daughter out in public instead, which is even worse for the woman.
- Donna, England, 12/7/2010 17:48
Click to rate (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/worldnews/article-1294099/French-MPs-vote-burkha-ban-imprison-men-force-wives-wear-them.html#) (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/worldnews/article-1294099/French-MPs-vote-burkha-ban-imprison-men-force-wives-wear-them.html#) Rating (0)
Report abuse (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/worldnews/reportAbuseInComment.html?articleId=1294099&commentId=24712550)
Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/worldnews/article-1294099/French-MPs-vote-burkha-ban-imprison-men-force-wives-wear-them.html#ixzz0tUcyP22D
At last, at f, ing last a ray of hope !
By Mail Foreign Service (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/home/search.html?s=y&authornamef=Mail+Foreign+Service)
Last updated at 4:31 PM on 12th July 2010
France could ban burkhas by the end of September after a series of parliamentary votes was scheduled to begin.
Deputies, or members of the lower house, are tomorrow likely to approve the measure outlawing face-covering veils despite outrage among the country’s 5million Muslims.
And the could be ratified in September when Senators are almost certain to approve the ban which has received overwhelming support from voters.
http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2010/07/12/article-0-0A56D37E000005DC-511_468x339.jpg Outrage: A Muslim woman in a face-covering niqab holds her French passport
There was little resistance among lawmakers today as they debated bill that proposes to fine wearers £140 and imprison men who force their wives to put on the outfit.
But the ban could be shot down by France's constitutional watchdog or the European Court of Human Rights.
That could dampen efforts under way in other European countries toward banning the veils.
It would also be a humiliation for President Nicolas Sarkozy's conservative government, which has devoted much attention to a bill that would affect only an estimated 1,900 women in France.
The main body representing French Muslims says face-covering veils are not required by Islam and not suitable in France, but it worries that the law will stigmatize Muslims in general.
The niqab and burkha are widely seen in France as a gateway to extremism and an attack on women's rights and secularism, a central value of modern-day France. Critics say a ban is a cynical ploy to attract far-right voters.
The government has struggled - and failed, some legal observers say - to come up with a strong legal basis for a ban.
In March, France's highest administrative body, the Council of State, warned that it could be found unconstitutional. It rejected possible legal justifications one by one, including the French tradition of secularism, equality for women, human dignity and concerns about public security.
In the end, the government's central legal argument is that covering one's face doesn't square with French values.
Life in France is ‘carried out with a bare face,’ Justice Minister Michele Alliot-Marie said last week, opening debate at the National Assembly.
As legal reasoning, she invoked the notion of public policy doctrine, a country's moral and social rules.
Face-covering veils ‘call into question the idea of integration, which is founded on the acceptance of the values of our society,’ Alliot-Marie said.
The legislation would forbid face-covering Muslim veils in all public places in France, even in the street.
It calls for £140 fines or citizenship classes, or both.
The bill is also aimed at husbands and fathers who impose such veils on women and girls.
Anyone convicted of forcing someone else to wear the garb risks a year of prison and a £25,000 fine - with both those penalties doubled if the victim is a minor.
Officials have taken pains to craft language that does not single out Muslims. While the proposed legislation is colloquially referred to as the ‘anti-burkha law,’ it is officially called ‘the bill to forbid concealing one's face in public.’
It refers neither to Islam nor to veils - leading to an often surreal disconnect between the text and discussion in parliament about it. While officials insist the law against face-covering would apply to everyone, not just Muslims, they cite a host of exceptions, including masks for health reasons, for fencing, for carnivals and festivals.
Legislator Berengere Poletti, of Sarkozy's conservative party, argued that women in such garb ‘wear a sign of alienation on their faces’ and ‘must be liberated,’ even if they say the apparel is their own choice.
Communist Andre Gerin, who also supports a ban, said that ‘talking about liberty to defend the wearing of the full veil is totally cynical - for me, the full veil is a walking coffin, a muzzle.’
Socialist Jean Glavany, one of the few lawmakers to offer stinging criticism of a ban, said dwelling on questions of French identity and whether burkhas are welcome in France ‘is nothing more than the fear of those who are different, who come from abroad, who aren't like us, who don't share our values.’
He was also one of several lawmakers to question the bill's ‘judicial fragility.’
To address that widespread concern, the conservative majority has taken the unusual step of asking the Constitutional Council watchdog to examine the bill once it passes parliament - a move usually made by opponents of legislation.
Down the road, the law could face another challenge at the European Court of Human Rights in Strasbourg, where decisions are binding.
In February, the court shot down a Turkish decision that convicted dozens of people for wearing religious clothing in public.
Comments (27)
Here's what readers have had to say so far. Why not add your thoughts below, or debate this issue live on our message boards. (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/index.html)
The comments below have been moderated in advance.
They won't dare do it , for fear of the back lash .
- parrcent, merseyside, 12/7/2010 18:00
Click to rate (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/worldnews/article-1294099/French-MPs-vote-burkha-ban-imprison-men-force-wives-wear-them.html#) (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/worldnews/article-1294099/French-MPs-vote-burkha-ban-imprison-men-force-wives-wear-them.html#) Rating 1
Report abuse (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/worldnews/reportAbuseInComment.html?articleId=1294099&commentId=24712662)
French have the guts not like our country.
- Kiran, Swindon, England, 12/7/2010 17:58
Click to rate (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/worldnews/article-1294099/French-MPs-vote-burkha-ban-imprison-men-force-wives-wear-them.html#) (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/worldnews/article-1294099/French-MPs-vote-burkha-ban-imprison-men-force-wives-wear-them.html#) Rating 3
Report abuse (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/worldnews/reportAbuseInComment.html?articleId=1294099&commentId=24712592)
Never thought to say it about those socialist overspenders, but on this one: Viva la France!
- Linda, Farmington, USA, 12/7/2010 17:49
Click to rate (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/worldnews/article-1294099/French-MPs-vote-burkha-ban-imprison-men-force-wives-wear-them.html#) (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/worldnews/article-1294099/French-MPs-vote-burkha-ban-imprison-men-force-wives-wear-them.html#) Rating 3
Report abuse (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/worldnews/reportAbuseInComment.html?articleId=1294099&commentId=24712498)
Well done France, show the dithering British politicians the way to go, they are feared of their own shadows, but not when it comes to making money from their pathetic memoirs..Now who in their right mind would want to read such rubbish for doing nothing........
- BRONCO LINCOLN, BRITISH ISLES, 12/7/2010 17:48
Click to rate (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/worldnews/article-1294099/French-MPs-vote-burkha-ban-imprison-men-force-wives-wear-them.html#) (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/worldnews/article-1294099/French-MPs-vote-burkha-ban-imprison-men-force-wives-wear-them.html#) Rating (0)
Report abuse (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/worldnews/reportAbuseInComment.html?articleId=1294099&commentId=24712486)
I fail to see how this would help matters. Men who force women to wear such things won't stop just because of a prison sentence or fine, they simply won't let their wife/daughter out in public instead, which is even worse for the woman.
- Donna, England, 12/7/2010 17:48
Click to rate (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/worldnews/article-1294099/French-MPs-vote-burkha-ban-imprison-men-force-wives-wear-them.html#) (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/worldnews/article-1294099/French-MPs-vote-burkha-ban-imprison-men-force-wives-wear-them.html#) Rating (0)
Report abuse (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/worldnews/reportAbuseInComment.html?articleId=1294099&commentId=24712550)
Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/worldnews/article-1294099/French-MPs-vote-burkha-ban-imprison-men-force-wives-wear-them.html#ixzz0tUcyP22D
At last, at f, ing last a ray of hope !