When people ask why I have a problem with religion....

[gazzthompson]

....it's hard to come up with a single answer...

http://i.imgur.com/mpQA0.jpg

(i did not make this)

[DevilDog812]

Most of those are true, but you are grouping the extremists and every crazy in there as well. I don't believe all Muslims are anti-westerner jihadists, nor do I think all Catholics are rapists. Athiests have more than their fair share of threat-givers and name callers as well, just like everything else. If a football fan kills a fan from the other team because he cheered for a different group, does that make every single football fan a murderer, and you would have a problem with football itself? Now, that seems a little extreme to me.

[Sixx]

Gazz, when you think about it bro....
It's not Religion that is the issue. Our species is the problem, by nature we are predators.......and we tend to be tribal and extremely violent.

Why do you think our prisons are filled up to the brim with murderers and rapists...
It's not coincidental.

We are one fucked up species, since day one.

Sure religion adds fuel to the fire, but that is not the governing factor of our flawed existence.



It's a shame though, because we can adapt and live peacefully amongst each other......we just simply refuse to do it.


Violence, war, and total destruction is embedded so deeply that we will never have peace and free will.


Quite frankly, we are fucked as each decade gets worse.

[jamieooh]

Gazz,
I tend to agree with you there.
I'm not religious at all.

http://youtu.be/mQorzOS-F6w I don't agree with everything Christopher Hitchen says, but quite a bit of it.

[nastyleg]

Here is my response.
http://m.youtube.com/#/watch?desktop_uri=%2Fwatch%3Fv%3DoppHeMlaLVM&v=oppHeMlaLVM&gl=US

[gazzthompson]

I fucking hate religion and this is why: Anti-intellectual, dogma, intolerance, hate, fear, close mindedness are all the trademarks and MO's of Religion.

When religions hold to an absolute claim on the truth, they turn inward, marking outsiders as "The Other". It's a "With us or against us" attitude that is clear in MANY people's attitudes outside of religion (Politics...) and stumps progression and compromise. And these "others" is going to hell of all places!

Religion cannot adapt to a changing world, it has a mentality that it's okay to not know things, to have "faith" in things and this is an unacceptable mentality for mankind. This fear, Intolerance and hate is not just a religious thing, it controls a person's other aspects of life and chain of thought and comes through in their attitude and in some cases, Politics.. Ill quote two people here who explain it better:

" It is easy for religious faith, even if it is irrational in itself, to lead a sane and decent person, by rational, logical steps, to do terrible things. There is a logical path from religious faith to evil deeds. There is no logical path from atheism to evil deeds. Of course, many evil deeds are done by individuals who happen to be atheists. But it can never be rational to say that, because of my nonbelief in religion, it would be good to be cruel, to murder, to oppress women, or to perpetrate any of the evils on the Hitchens list." -Richard Dawkins

"With or without religion, you would have good people doing good things and evil people doing evil things. But for good people to do evil things, that takes religion." -Steven Weinberg

Then it comes to morality, the idea that some hold that morality without religion is impossible is horrifying. Another quote which explains it better than me:

"A man's ethical behaviour should be based effectually on sympathy, education, and social ties; no religious basis is necessary. Man would indeed be in a poor way if he had to be restrained by fear of punishment and hope of reward after death." -Albert Einstein

And religions apparent morality being pushed onto others and hindering human process (Stem cell research, Euthanasia, Same Sex Marriage) Pisses me the fuck off.

All of the above combine to control a person, and cause ALOT of problems on many scales. From the beaten dead horse of the crusades to intolerance of atheist and homosexuals today. It blows my mind and sickens me that someone i met in texas has, at the age of 20, left home because of the intolerance of her own family to her atheism, and I've read a lot more cases of this. Or the girl who got a Christian school banner removed and received death threats and was called "evil" by a politician!

Oh and this is just what i think of Christianity. I don't have the time to get onto the disgusting religion of islam. Wrote mostly on phone, forgive the formatting/ Spelling.Had to get that off my chest, figured forum was better than home page for this.

[DevilDog812]

I can't post much 'cause I'm in school, but I find the fact that you are bitching about intolerance, hate, fear, and closemindedness while bashing any and all religions and religious peoples quite hilariously hypocritical.

[gazzthompson]

I accept the hypocrisy of hating something that promotes and is driven by hate, but I hate an idea , a belief system. Not the person. The other words don't apply. I see it as a danger to man kind and its progression and needs to be challenged and every opportunity.

[noman1200]

Gazz you can't hate just the belief you have to hate it all you can't pick a choose. And hate blinsd us to the good the object of are hatred can do.

[eaglethebeagle]

ugg I was ignoring this but I will respond.

First religion is not the problem is it? I ask because again the United States was founded by Christians with intent on freedom of religion. The founders mostly were Christian although Ben Franklin was an atheist with a touch of undecided as he remarked about God as he existed only to not be certain so he was struggling with the idea to say the least.

To my first point what has America become? We are a nation full of all religions not only Christian but Jews, muslims, budda, satanist...I dont consider some of these religions but for sake of argument lets say all these everything under the sun that claims to be religion is a religion. Then why are they allowed here in the United States? Because it was the belief of these mostly Christian men that this was the way a country should work. Freedoms of all kinds including religion. There was no Christians killing Jews or Christians killing muslims in the United States ever unless gazz knows something I dont. So is Christian faith evil? The truth is like Sixx said the evil is in man or mankind. People are flawed from the beginning. Religion if it is sincere which Christianity is teaches love, good will towards man, do not kill or steal etc etc (see ten commandments).

So people are screwed up and can do anything they want to do including bastardize religion. I can claim to be Christian and go kill innocent people and say God made me do it. This however would be not in line with the Bible and what the Bible teaches. On the other hand islam and koran specifically states to kill Jews and Christians. So their religion does teach killing and hate. That is why I dont consider islam a real religion. Unless they rewrite the koran and remove the killing and hate it is a cult with an agenda.

I think people like to find evil and then say look that person was a Christian and he killed or committed a crime so look Christians are just as bad as anyone else. Well that person will face his judgement with God. There is not one Christian on earth that is perfect or better than anyone else. The purpose of being Christian is to strive to be what God wants and Jesus was the example. To help others and follow Gods commands.

Even knowing all this the best Christian is going to fail as it is not possible to be perfect or ideal all the time. SO when you fail you confess your sins and ask for forgiveness. You want to try to be good but we are destined to fail and that is what people who are not Christian dont understand.

No one said being a Christian means you will be like Jesus Christ that is not possible. We all have free will and if we choose to be good and follow God then there is a reward if we dont choose to follow God and want to seek murder and hate then that person will eventually meet his fate.

The people in the middle must decide on their own if they need to search out more answers about God. If you are not a believer then that is your deal and there is no text in the Bible that tell any Christian to cut off the head of a non believer. God will sort out everyone in the end. islam thinks they are their own god on earth and should kill non believers so that is against what the Bible says and they will meet their demise eventually like I said.

That is my view and if someone else disagrees go ahead freedom of speech I am all for it.


:USA:

[Mel]

I have no problem with religion,It's the cheerleaders that piss me off the most.

[gazzthompson]

I have no problem with religion,It's the cheerleaders that piss me off the most.

Reminds me of a quote by Gandhi (I Believe he said it anyway)

"I like your Christ. I do not like your Christians."

Eagle, i'm a bit hanging from last night so ill keep it quick. I don't know of Christians killing jews or muslims, but i do know of Christians killing abortion doctors, (Quick look at wiki, just for a ball park figure) 8+ Deaths, 7 attempted murders, 383 death threats, 153 incidents of assault or battery, and 3 kidnappings committed against abortion providers, According to NAF, since 1977 in the United States and Canada, property crimes committed against abortion providers have included 41 bombings, 173 arsons, 91 attempted bombings or arsons, 619 bomb threats, 1630 incidents of trespassing, 1264 incidents of vandalism, and 100 attacks with butyric acid . Cant be assed to check fully the sources, but its a ball park.


But its not just physical violence , As this is not a major problem. Its the mentality which i covered that it promotes that controls a person, its like a poison;

Anti-intellectualism: (Creationism, Evolution rejection, Stem Cell research, No room for change in mentality, Its okay not to know and have "faith"
Dogma
intolerance (Atheism, Homosexuality)
hate
fear
close mindedness (All of the above)

And as i said, its not just physical violence. i post on a forum that helps Atheists "come out" . Up intil recently this concept was alien to me, "Coming out" as an Atheist? Never heard of such thing as we don't have to here. and the stories i read break my heart. A good friend who i met in texas has left her home at the age of 20 because of her families intolerance of her atheism. The girl receiving death threats because a judge agreed to remove a pray banner from school (Apparently a court of law doesn't matter to some) . It sickens me and its acceptable to alot of people. Now dont get me wrong, this is nowhere near the problem of Islamic terrorism etc but its a problem.

But anyway, just got a text from my gunsmith that my parts have arrived so im off.

[762happy]

Troll

[noman1200]

I give him Troll of 10/10

[eaglethebeagle]

I have no problem with religion,It's the cheerleaders that piss me off the most.

I think I understand this statement but I dont want to assume and be wrong....Is it you dont like the people who wait outside a Wal-Mart and ask you if you are saved? If that is the case or the Jehovah witness that ride around on their bikes and go door to door may be your issue. Either one I understand the feeling of not wanting to be harassed or solicited to.

The best way to witness or show what Christianity is is to be a good person and do what the Bible ask you to do. In some cases there are people who are out there who dont know what Christianity stands for and they are actually interested in learning. I actually was a person who pushed away from faith I had many reasons to not believe so I thought. In the end I feel good about where I currently stand in life and the more I study the Bible the better I am.

In this regard I dont think God is a product so selling Him outside a Wal-mart or going door to door isnt the proper way to teach Christianity so I think but maybe I am wrong I dont know. I also get tired of the anti religion cheerleaders as that gets old.

[gazzthompson]

Troll

I'm not sure if you have a complete inability to comprehend sentences or you just have no idea what troll is or what...

Edit: You probably wont understand and automatically default to "troll" so ill just leave this picture

http://www.themeparkreview.com/forum/files/jesus-facepalm_0.jpg

[eaglethebeagle]

idiot

[eaglethebeagle]

I'm not sure if you have a complete inability to comprehend sentences or you just have no idea what troll is or what...

Edit: You probably wont understand and automatically default to "troll" so ill just leave this picture

http://www.themeparkreview.com/forum/files/jesus-facepalm_0.jpg



this what a troll does gazz your just an asshole to be an asshole .....that is who you are

[gazzthompson]

I have no words... i tried. Debate on this website is impossible, its just impossible..... i just... fuck.

This is what trying to have a debate on this website is like:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4DVAsmrwdtQ

No Eagle. No. Just no.

Replying to my comment with a single word "troll", THATS trolling. THATS fucking trolling. But as usual, your start swearing and throwing your toys out of your pram and throwing the word "troll" left right and centre at everything you see. This really is the most pathetic website for any form of discussion ive ever been on. And ive been on youtube and 4chan, so that is saying something. Im done, my opinion on the poison that is religion is there discussion has clearly ceased.

[noman1200]

then git your ass off are website.

[gazzthompson]

"Don't agree with me !?! then you can leave!!"

How very close minded of you... oh wait.. nope, wont go there.

http://www.ft.com/cms/s/2/d2239780-4d4e-11e1-8741-00144feabdc0.html#axzz1lPts0Nwr

Another article I found today...

Anybody wonder why this website isn't bigger? doesn't have more regular posters for a website of such great content? This. This is why.

But fuck this, I'm going to go back to trying my best to help the friends i made in the US and the people on the atheist forum "come out" (absolutely disgusting that they even have to come out..) and help them deal with religious oppression and persecution whistle you guys continue to scream TROLL at anything that moves.