Canada turned down NATO request for more troops

[bobdina]

Canada turned down NATO request for more troops: docs

The Canadian Press

Date: Sunday Aug. 22, 2010 1:49 PM ET

OTTAWA — Canada turned down a direct plea from NATO to send more troops into southern Afghanistan in the run-up to last year's Afghan presidential election, federal documents say.

It was among the most specific requests Ottawa has received over the years and provides a keen illustration of the pitfalls the Conservative government faces both at home and abroad as it slowly untangles the country from the costly war.

A briefing note prepared for Defence Minister Peter MacKay showed that both NATO and the U.S. expected Canada to ante up the extra troops needed to secure Kandahar from an anticipated wave of Taliban violence prior to the vote.

The plea was turned down cold.

There was a hint of exasperation in the comments category of the note, suggesting that the allies seem oblivious to both the strain that four years of fighting has placed on Canada's small army and the bruising political debate that has battered the minority government.

"The U.S. and NATO had hoped that Canada, as one of the lead nations in (Regional Command) South, would generate the required supplementary forces for south," said the Jan. 23, 2009 briefing document.

"It will be important to communicate to allies -- and perhaps the Canadian public -- that Canada is already contributing significant military resources to the region where the threat of election-related violence is the highest. While the CF will review and assess future NATO requests for supplementary election forces, allies should understand that Canada is already contributing to the maximum extent possible."

Last winter, NATO asked for more military trainers and Canada sent 90 soldiers. But it was underlined -- once again -- that they go home when the rest of the army leaves next July.

That the requests keep coming even though Ottawa has formally signalled its withdrawal plans speaks volumes, not only about allied perceptions of the country's military capacity, but the international expectations built up by the Conservative government's tough-sounding rhetoric of not cutting and running.

Douglas Bland, of Queens University's defence management studies centre, said the Afghan mission may be over next year, but the perception that Canada can be counted on to carry the heavy load will likely remain for years to come.

The briefing note urged MacKay to turn the tables on NATO allies and press those already in Afghanistan to remove restrictions that prevent them from fighting in the south.

MacKay, in a recent interview, conceded NATO had come to expect a lot of Canada because the country has "contributed so mightily" to the campaign.

"I would argue that we've done more than most for a military of our size," he said. "Without opening up the whole issue of burden-sharing, I do think we have to continually remind, in some cases, many who follow the mission closely Canada that has been and remains a major contributor to the mission in Afghanistan."

What MacKay didn't address was how you ratchet back those expectations at a time when the U.S. is consumed with Afghanistan and redoubling efforts to batter the Taliban into submission.

Bland said it's up to the government to say 'no' more forcefully.

The fact Canada cannot -- or is unwilling -- to produce even a few hundred extra soldiers at such critical junctures as the election and the planned offensive in Kandahar mystifies some NATO commanders in Kabul.

NATO sources in Kabul said U.S. commanders in particular don't understand how their northern neighbour could have produced over 4,000 troops for peacekeeping in the Balkans in the 1990s -- a time of budget restraint -- and yet claim the well is dry while fighting a war. They question Canada's short rotation system of six-month deployments and nearly year-long training programs for each battle group.

The Canadian army did examine the request for extra soldiers for the 2009 Afghan election and developed two options. One involved overlapping the tours of incoming and outgoing battle groups, which would have temporarily doubled the number of soldiers on the ground.

The second option was censored in the documents, but ultimately both suggestions were rejected.

Bland said he doesn't see much lasting political damage with NATO, but said the United States is another matter.

"The American military officers can be pretty aggressive and not understand our politics because they don't understand our country and method of government," Bland said.

"They have their own expectations of what we would be able to do and if they were running our Armed Forces they would do it differently. We used to get that all the time from the Brits. They tell us exactly the same kind of crap, but that's what you get when you're small nation."

http://www.ctv.ca/CTVNews/Afghanistan/20100822/canada-nato-request-troops-100822/

[Devious187]

Good. I don't want anymore of us Canadians out there.

[Toki]

I think I'll bite my tongue and not bash Canadians on this.

[Devious187]

Go ahead do it. Don't be scared, Tokenvi

I'll be glad to share also,after you.

[Toki]

Go ahead do it. Don't be scared, Tokenvi

I'll be glad to share also,after you.

I think if you are going to send your country's troops to war, then commit 100%. NATO and non-NATO countries that are sending a handful of their soldiers are doing a disservice their allies. Either go head first or stay home.

[Devious187]

I think if you are going to send your country's troops to war, then commit 100%. NATO and non-NATO countries that are sending a handful of their soldiers are doing a disservice their allies. Either go head first or stay home.

very good point,makes me relenquish my thoughts that i had..Altho when i served in the CAF, we were treated like shit. Like we were not even needed. I only agreed to the govt's apposal due to me own experience i had there. I kinda felt like we were the guys in this picture.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v239/DR_MAXX/puppets.jpg

[Toki]

Isn't that what every soldier is supposed to do? I.E. following orders.

[Devious187]

Affirmative.

[MickDonalds]

Gee...Canada (with their serious inferiority complex) failing us again?

Why I'm sooooo surprised!!! :roleyes:

Hard to believe with Canada's policies and beliefs that they consider themselves "North American" because I swear, the amount of Eurotrash spewed out of that government...

[Markoxx]

hmm interesting and weird.

[thomasjkelley]

What a joke! Canada claims 2000 troops is all they can spare! Canada has a population of 30+ Million people, US has 300+ Million. That would be the equivalent of us committing 20,000 troops and claiming that we are stretched thin. The Canadian gov't hates America as much as the Obama administration does! They are always scolding and reprimanding us for one reason or another. The resentment of the US is so profound in Canada that Benedict Arnold murals are painted all over the country claiming him as a Canadian hero. They sing folk songs about Canadian rebels and border raids and stealing Yankee gold. They blame us for them being an inconsequential nation.

[MickDonalds]

Added to the insult and injury from Canada is the fact that they've enjoyed 50+ years of defacto protection from it's southern neighbor.

And we don't even get a fuckin' thank you!

"Hey US, thanks for protecting us by building your military up so mightily on the world stage that it'd be insanity for any country to try and attack us"

I've harbored a deep resentment of Canada for a very long time. I'm just tired of their "inferiority complex" (where they nag the rest of the world about how much better they think they are).

[daoust]

Added to the insult and injury from Canada is the fact that they've enjoyed 50+ years of defacto protection from it's southern neighbor.

And we don't even get a fuckin' thank you!

"Hey US, thanks for protecting us by building your military up so mightily on the world stage that it'd be insanity for any country to try and attack us"

I've harbored a deep resentment of Canada for a very long time. I'm just tired of their "inferiority complex" (where they nag the rest of the world about how much better they think they are).

That attitude is gonna get you far... no its not

[Devious187]

Added to the insult and injury from Canada is the fact that they've enjoyed 50+ years of defacto protection from it's southern neighbor.

And we don't even get a fuckin' thank you!

"Hey US, thanks for protecting us by building your military up so mightily on the world stage that it'd be insanity for any country to try and attack us"

I've harbored a deep resentment of Canada for a very long time. I'm just tired of their "inferiority complex" (where they nag the rest of the world about how much better they think they are).

hahah really?? we think we are better? Nahh we are just a fairly peaceful country.

[eaglethebeagle]

"All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing."

Canada is a peaceful country? Devious your a peaceful country because your pacifist not for any other reason. I guess your country can do that because your not relevant to the terrorist. Lets see if you ever get a massive terrorist attack on your land what your country does.

[Colin_S]

looking at the comments on this thread, im not sure why my country helps at all with the respect were being given

[Colin_S]

What a joke! Canada claims 2000 troops is all they can spare! Canada has a population of 30+ Million people, US has 300+ Million. That would be the equivalent of us committing 20,000 troops and claiming that we are stretched thin. The Canadian gov't hates America as much as the Obama administration does! They are always scolding and reprimanding us for one reason or another. The resentment of the US is so profound in Canada that Benedict Arnold murals are painted all over the country claiming him as a Canadian hero. They sing folk songs about Canadian rebels and border raids and stealing Yankee gold. They blame us for them being an inconsequential nation.

Dude wtf are you talking about?? i have not seen a single mural of Benedict Arnold in the 20 years that i have lived in Canada, Nor have i EVER heard a folk song about "stealing Yankee gold". Have you ever been to Canada???

[MickDonalds]

looking at the comments on this thread, im not sure why my country helps at all with the respect were being given

Quite frankly, I'm surprised your country helps at all too, based upon how they act.

Any day now I'm waiting for the next round of "quitters" to announce themselves.

[Colin_S]

Quite frankly, I'm surprised your country helps at all too, based upon how they act.

Any day now I'm waiting for the next round of "quitters" to announce themselves.

You claim that we Canadians bug every other country in the world about how much "better" we are than everyone else, and yet you sit behind your computer doing just that.

Do you forget who held down Afghanistan for the years that you were off on a treasure hunt in Iraq?

We've paid our dues over there, we don't need your condescending bullshit.

[MickDonalds]

You claim that we Canadians bug every other country in the world about how much "better" we are than everyone else, and yet you sit behind your computer doing just that.

Do you forget who held down Afghanistan for the years that you were off on a treasure hunt in Iraq?

We've paid our dues over there, we don't need your condescending bullshit.

Oh so you "Held Down Afghanistan"? What with your 3-4,000 troops?

Hah! Good one! That made me smile, it really did. Keep trying though.

And look! ANOTHER Canadian dissenting Iraq. Boy oh boy, they must PAY you guys to shit-talk the Iraq War, huh? I mean it's unanimous!

[Colin_S]

Oh so you "Held Down Afghanistan"? What with your 3-4,000 troops?

Hah! Good one! That made me smile, it really did. Keep trying though.

And look! ANOTHER Canadian dissenting Iraq. Boy oh boy, they must PAY you guys to shit-talk the Iraq War, huh? I mean it's unanimous!

I think you should calm yourself man. We didn't go into Iraq because our people pretty much unanimously agreed that it was bullshit. The fact that there were no WMDs found is proof enough for us.

You shit talk our government yet you do the same to your own. At least ours is capable of representing our people.

You really need to realize that were on the same side, and that bashing your own allies isn't going to get you any help, or do you think you can go it alone?

[bmackay]

Oh so you "Held Down Afghanistan"? What with your 3-4,000 troops?

Hah! Good one! That made me smile, it really did. Keep trying though.

And look! ANOTHER Canadian dissenting Iraq. Boy oh boy, they must PAY you guys to shit-talk the Iraq War, huh? I mean it's unanimous!


This thread really opened my mind to how our brothers in arms think about us, or at least you. Some of the stuff said here is HILARIOUS folk tales about yankee gold LOL. Did any of you even follow Afghanistan 2001- 2008? no? maybe you should do your research when the US said HEY we need someone to take over kandahar province while we forget about this mission, who was the first to raise their hand? it really puts a new light on things for me with appreciation like this. RIP to our fallen, at least Canadians will never forget.

[Dire]

Upsetting to see Mickdonalds talk the way he does, thanks for the respect man.

"And look! ANOTHER Canadian dissenting Iraq. Boy oh boy, they must PAY you guys to shit-talk the Iraq War, huh? I mean it's unanimous!"

Do you even hear yourself? Dude, half your own country was against going into Iraq.

Yes dude, it took 3-4k Canadian troops to hold down Kandahar, while it takes 20k US troops to do the exact same thing.

I know, not all Americans are as ignorant as Mickdonalds, but this guy takes the cake..

[death2mooj]

I think you should calm yourself man. We didn't go into Iraq because our people pretty much unanimously agreed that it was bullshit. The fact that there were no WMDs found is proof enough for us.

You shit talk our government yet you do the same to your own. At least ours is capable of representing our people.

You really need to realize that were on the same side, and that bashing your own allies isn't going to get you any help, or do you think you can go it alone?

There was gas and other nasties in Iraq, that's a fact. They tracked the shit being trucked over the border to Syria. Look it up if you don't believe me. Hell you can probably find the footage yourself.

[Colin_S]

There was gas and other nasties in Iraq, that's a fact. They tracked the shit being trucked over the border to Syria. Look it up if you don't believe me. Hell you can probably find the footage yourself.

That may be true, although i cannot find any concrete proof of it myself. I am also not all that concerned either. Do you believe that Saddam had the capability to use chemical weapons on the West anyway? of course not, it was more a danger if he had given those weapons to terrorist groups or used them to slaughter Kurds. Fact is that he has had those weapons for decades and never used them on us, and neither have any terrorist organizations. Now if we had found a nuclear bomb or something to that nature in Iraq i would have to say that it was necessary to invade, but i never believed that they did and they never found one.

I think we need to get back to the main point of this thread however. It was about NATO asking Canada for more troops to deploy to Afghanistan, not the ethics of invading Iraq.

[theshoebox]

This thread is going to hell, fast.

Canadian soldiers have fought hard, and they have lost a lot of men.

I understand what a lot of you guys are talking about and I think a lot of it
is true, but stay humble. If Canada ever gets into a war(doubt it, pacifist comment
by eagle noted)we won't get into it, simple.

Ultimately, we were the ones that were attacked, and as long as our people
still have the hunger to keep killing these shit bags that continue to attack us
while we make Afghanistan stable, than we should support OUR troops.

Thank you for your service Canada, but we won't get on our knees and beg.

[chanceboodro]

You're the worlds last hope Mick. For the handicapable. The Brits left you, The Dutch, The Canadians. The biggest allies. You guys seem to want it that way. You've been committed till 2015 so have fun. When you defeat the taliban, which you won't and still have fight left in you, come to anywhere Canada and fish. Relax. Then say what you say. And pick up your fuckin teeth after.

[MickDonalds]

You're the worlds last hope Mick. For the handicapable. The Brits left you, The Dutch, The Canadians. The biggest allies. You guys seem to want it that way. You've been committed till 2015 so have fun. When you defeat the taliban, which you won't and still have fight left in you, come to anywhere Canada and fish. Relax. Then say what you say. And pick up your fuckin teeth after.

And pick up my teeth after? Zing!


Yes dude, it took 3-4k Canadian troops to hold down Kandahar, while it takes 20k US troops to do the exact same thing.


God, you Canucks make me laugh with your artificial belief that you'v done so much for A'stan. You took Kandahar province and couldn't hold it down because it's gotten out of control. If anything, your boys failed and failed and failed. But hey, you did get that world sniper distance kill record, am I right?

[Colin_S]

This thread is going to hell, fast.

Canadian soldiers have fought hard, and they have lost a lot of men.

I understand what a lot of you guys are talking about and I think a lot of it
is true, but stay humble. If Canada ever gets into a war(doubt it, pacifist comment
by eagle noted)we won't get into it, simple.

Ultimately, we were the ones that were attacked, and as long as our people
still have the hunger to keep killing these shit bags that continue to attack us
while we make Afghanistan stable, than we should support OUR troops.

Thank you for your service Canada, but we won't get on our knees and beg.

Thank you for giving your opinion in a civilized manor. However, i do not completely see your point. When you were attacked on 9/11 we did step in to help you. And i have no regrets as far as that is concerned. But why do you feel that you should not help us out if we get into a war? Do you feel that we would start a war for our own national interests? Granted there have been wars that us Canadians refuse to participate in, but only when we believe that it does not make sense for us to do so. We have been the closest of allies for over 100 years, and I do believe it should stay that way.

[Colin_S]

And pick up my teeth after? Zing!




God, you Canucks make me laugh with your artificial belief that you'v done so much for A'stan. You took Kandahar province and couldn't hold it down because it's gotten out of control. If anything, your boys failed and failed and failed. But hey, you did get that world sniper distance kill record, am I right?

So we've "failed failed and failed" in Afghanistan? If that is the case what do you say about your own record in Afghanistan? By that standard the American army has failed just as miserably to stabilize Afghanistan.

[thomasjkelley]

Yes Colin I have. I did not make that up. The mural is in St. Johns, down by the water front on the outskirts of the city! I can understand you taking offense; you feel like your country is being attacked. Try and understand, Canada/Canadians are consistently badmouthing us on the international stage. They never defend us, never take our side publicly and criticize our every policy. I'm feeling a bit offended myself.

[Colin_S]

A single mural in St. John does not amount to us proclaiming Benedict Arnold as a Canadian hero. I have not seen this mural before and have not been to St. Johns but you have to understand that Canada is a much different country than America. The people in St.John do not represent the peoples from other provinces/territories, in fact they also resent us citizens of Ontario. Pretty much all the other provinces resent us actually. You cannot generalize Canadians because we are the most diverse country in the world and i would like to see anyone prove otherwise. Of course we feel offended, your making these sweeping generalizations of all Canadians because you saw a mural of Benedict Arnold and heard a bunch of drunks sing a song about "Yankee Gold" as you put it.

[death2mooj]

And pick up my teeth after? Zing!




God, you Canucks make me laugh with your artificial belief that you'v done so much for A'stan. You took Kandahar province and couldn't hold it down because it's gotten out of control. If anything, your boys failed and failed and failed. But hey, you did get that world sniper distance kill record, am I right?

Brits broke that record

[theshoebox]

Thank you for giving your opinion in a civilized manor. However, i do not completely see your point. When you were attacked on 9/11 we did step in to help you. And i have no regrets as far as that is concerned. But why do you feel that you should not help us out if we get into a war? Do you feel that we would start a war for our own national interests? Granted there have been wars that us Canadians refuse to participate in, but only when we believe that it does not make sense for us to do so. We have been the closest of allies for over 100 years, and I do believe it should stay that way.

I stopped reading your post after "Do you feel that we would start a war for our own national interests?" Afghanistan is an oil rich country which is why we invaded...

Congratulations, you have watched Zeitgeist and have been brainwashed by a movie that talks about the government brainwashing its citizens and misleading them.

We have taken the bulk of the casualties for both wars(one of which Canada has participated in). You guys took some casualties as well, but as soon as you do, you quit.

You can't do the hokey pokey with wars. Either keep your foot in, or keep it out.

[Colin_S]

I stopped reading your post after "Do you feel that we would start a war for our own national interests?" Afghanistan is an oil rich country which is why we invaded...

Congratulations, you have watched Zeitgeist and have been brainwashed by a movie that talks about the government brainwashing its citizens and misleading them.

We have taken the bulk of the casualties for both wars(one of which Canada has participated in). You guys took some casualties as well, but as soon as you do, you quit.

You can't do the hokey pokey with wars. Either keep your foot in, or keep it out.

Maybe you should have kept reading. You think that Afghanistan was invaded because it is oil rich? or are you trying to saying that that is what i think? either way your way off base.

Afghanistan was invaded because the Taliban harbored Al-Queda terrorists, not because they have oil. which by the way they have almost zero infrastructure to extract anyway.

We took sustained casualties for 9 years and your saying that we play "hokey pokey"?

Zeitgeist? the fuck is that? and who said that the American people are brainwashed?

try filling someone else's mouth with your bullshit

[theshoebox]

I'll let you do a little bit of research before I embarass you.

[Colin_S]

haha go right ahead. your embarassing no one but yourself

[theshoebox]

Maybe you should have kept reading. You think that Afghanistan was invaded because it is oil rich? or are you trying to saying that that is what i think? either way your way off base.

Afghanistan was invaded because the Taliban harbored Al-Queda terrorists, not because they have oil. which by the way they have almost zero infrastructure to extract anyway.

We took sustained casualties for 9 years and your saying that we play "hokey pokey"?

Zeitgeist? the fuck is that? and who said that the American people are brainwashed?

try filling someone else's mouth with your bullshit

Sarcasm: "harsh or bitter derision or irony"

The fact that you weren't able to see the obvious irony in me saying that Afghanistan was oil rich shows how
truly asshurt you are.

The first Canadian casualties occured in 2002, four soldiers, they were the only casualties in 2002.

In 2003, two Canadian casualties, again from one incident, the only casualties that year.

In 2004, one casualty, the only casualty for that year, and same thing for 2005.

It wasn't until 2006 when Canada began sustaining a significant amount of casualties.

You guys didn't quit, you were defeated by the Taliban.

Zeitgeist is one of many conspiracy movies, and one of the most popular.
Judging by your faceless, and spineless statement that we invaded a country
for our own national interests(your country leeches off of my country btw,
so I wouldn't dare attempt to talk about my country's interests when your
country leeches off "what we benefit from"), I think you are familiar with
such movies.

[theshoebox]

http://inox.org/demot/TROLLING.jpg

Reminds me of somebody.

[Dire]

Reminds me of somebody.

LOL at saying Canada was defeated by the Taliban, then calling Colin a Troll, pot called the kettle black much?

[Colin_S]

Sarcasm: "harsh or bitter derision or irony"

The fact that you weren't able to see the obvious irony in me saying that Afghanistan was oil rich shows how
truly asshurt you are.

The first Canadian casualties occured in 2002, four soldiers, they were the only casualties in 2002.

In 2003, two Canadian casualties, again from one incident, the only casualties that year.

In 2004, one casualty, the only casualty for that year, and same thing for 2005.

It wasn't until 2006 when Canada began sustaining a significant amount of casualties.

You guys didn't quit, you were defeated by the Taliban.

Zeitgeist is one of many conspiracy movies, and one of the most popular.
Judging by your faceless, and spineless statement that we invaded a country
for our own national interests(your country leeches off of my country btw,
so I wouldn't dare attempt to talk about my country's interests when your
country leeches off "what we benefit from"), I think you are familiar with
such movies.

hahah again man you need to read what i have said. at what point did i say that you invaded a country for your own national interests? Please show me this statement. I clearly stated that Afghanistan was invaded because they harbored Al Queda. As i have eluded to in other comments as well.

we have lost over 150 in Afghanistan. America has lost approximately 1,100 (probably more because the number is only updated to July).I am not trying to dissmiss the sacrifices American service men have made in Afghanistan but keep in mind that our population is 1/10th the size of yours, and our military is probably less than 1/10th the size of yours so we simply do not have the manpower or military to do the same amount of work that yours can.

You say that my statement is spineless? which statement was that again? Spineless is trying to put words into someones mouth then bash them for that.

By the way, trying to be a tough guy on an internet forum is pretty lame dude

[theshoebox]

Do you feel that we would start a war for our own national interests?

Funny how I went from being civilized to being a tough guy on the internet forums in your perspective

Maybe I hit a soft spot with some cold hard facts?

What is the point of you constantly replying to this topic with spineless
responses, show me some facts to support your "argument," otherwise
you truly are a troll.

[bmackay]

Bottom line is this, your arguing with people who supported this fucking war for 9 fucking years, supported america, and supported what ALL our troops were doing. Now your throwing that in the face of some of your biggest international support. You know what I think now? FUCK YOU, fuck afghanistan and fuck your war, have fun for the next 5 years.

[theshoebox]

Also, why is it that everybody, from the Hungarians to the Japanese served
in Iraq, but Canada was nowhere to be found?

True allies, right?

[Colin_S]

http://inox.org/demot/TROLLING.jpg

Reminds me of somebody.

haha i really got a kick out of that

But seriously man, how am i trolling? i have made very clear statements and for the most part have stayed very civilized on the subject. Would you sit back and allow your country to be bashed the way that mine is? Helllll no you'd stand up for your country, the same way that i have.

[Colin_S]

Funny how I went from being civilized to being a tough guy on the internet forums in your perspective

Maybe I hit a soft spot with some cold hard facts?

What is the point of you constantly replying to this topic with spineless
responses, show me some facts to support your "argument," otherwise
you truly are a troll.

Oh man, there is a very clear difference between a statement and a question ( . opposed to ? generally). If you cannot see the difference between the two then there really isnt any point in arguing with you on the subject.

[MickDonalds]

Bottom line is this, your arguing with people who supported this fucking war for 9 fucking years, supported america, and supported what ALL our troops were doing. Now your throwing that in the face of some of your biggest international support. You know what I think now? FUCK YOU, fuck afghanistan and fuck your war, have fun for the next 5 years.

Spoken like a true pacifist from a country that HONORS war deserters from it's neighbors by giving them sanctuary, media attention and oh, a FUCKING memorial.

No, Fuck YOU and YOURS, buddy.

[Dire]

Spoken like a true pacifist from a country that HONORS war deserters from it's neighbors by giving them sanctuary, media attention and oh, a FUCKING memorial.

No, Fuck YOU and YOURS, buddy.

Hah, your a dumbass,
Fucken rights we support people that didnt want to be drafted into a War they did not want to fight, Do you honestly believe drafting people into your army is a good thing? Something that would produce good soliders? Fuck no, so of course we are going to help them, Soliders should want to be soliders, and thats the differance between the US army and the Canadian Forces, and thats why our basic soliders are better trained then you because they truley want to be soliders while you have snotty kids trying to make a buck or have nothing else to do.

It's time to leave your bubble Mick, you arnt the best country around my friend, and I have never heard a Canadian talk about his country the way Americans do, so get off your high horse and start giving respect when respect is due, if not, your gonna be a kid left alone playing by himself in his own sand box!

[Colin_S]

Okay people i think its enough. This thread has only caused a rift between the Americans and Canadians on this website. I have tried my best to stay respectful. If we cannot even accept that we are allies how can we co ordinate a war together? Can we not even agree to disagree?

[theshoebox]

Okay people i think its enough. This thread has only caused a rift between the Americans and Canadians on this website. I have tried my best to stay respectful. If we cannot even accept that we are allies how can we co ordinate a war together? Can we not even agree to disagree?

And your country has been defeated again, lol.

You being respectful, yeah, look back at your posts little man.

[Ripcord]

The first Canadian casualties occured in 2002, four soldiers, they were the only casualties in 2002.

In 2003, two Canadian casualties, again from one incident, the only casualties that year.

In 2004, one casualty, the only casualty for that year, and same thing for 2005.

It wasn't until 2006 when Canada began sustaining a significant amount of casualties.

You guys didn't quit, you were defeated by the Taliban.

The 4 soldiers killed in 2002 where killed by an American. 1 of those men killed was a very good friend of mine. I was ammo bitch during that incident and was 700m away from sharing their fate.

In 2006 another Canadian soldier was killed by our American allies.

I have been there 3 times..The Taliban never defeated us..our spineless politicians did.

HOW DARE you disrespect those that have served along side your country..hate our politicians and civilians all you want (hell i'm not a fan either) but you have no right to disrespect our soldiers who have fought and died alongside your troops.

You have not earned the right to shit talk any soldier until you have served..I don't see any pics of you in uniform or an Active/Ret/Vet badge by your name so you need to keep quiet while the men are talking.
that goes for all of you..shit talk our Politicians and hippy civilians all you want but until you have actually served you have not earned the right to shit talk a Soldier...Any American or other Army would not disrespect an Allie's soldiers because they know what it's like over there..
Real soldiers reserve all their shit talking for the W.O.Gs behind the lines who never leave the FOB

I have been to Iraq,(don't believe me ask a mod..I have pics in the Active/Retired/Vet area) while doing CP work for a Canadian V.I.P..there were uniformed Canadian soldiers there..on partnership programs..so ya technically we were there..just not Battalion or Company size..I can assure you if we had the chance our troops would have gone to Iraq just as confidently as we went to Asscrakistan..but that was our countries decision not to go, not ours(the soldier)..don't like it? too bad! that's what true freedom is.

[Ripcord]

Oh so you "Held Down Afghanistan"? What with your 3-4,000 troops?

Hah! Good one! That made me smile, it really did. Keep trying though.

I would expect more from a soldier then this BS your are spewing..

you are a disgrace, and have a lot of growing up to do.
Thankfully all the American soldiers I have met appreciate the help of the other country's that have fought alongside them in Afghanistan.
maybe when you actually go overseas your piss poor attitude will change.

[cormack]

Got a little crazy in here haha!

[gutro]

The 4 soldiers killed in 2002 where killed by an American. 1 of those men killed was a very good friend of mine. I was ammo bitch during that incident and was 700m away from sharing their fate.
.

Ripcord.... mind if I ask your name....(PM me).... my ears perked up on this comment. I've never served, but recall that incident very clearly.

As for the rest of your comments, I'm behind you 100%

I don't know what the fuck is wrong with these guys..... Shoebox is completely lost in the sauce....based on his casualty report Canada has been doing rather well. Based on the number of casualties, in shoeboxe's rational thinking, the American's are getting their asses kicked. They've lost hundreds of troops.

My point is, if you're going to use "facts" stick with them and don't speculate shit. Have some fucking respect for Allied soldiers.

[Ripcord]

Ripcord.... mind if I ask your name....(PM me).... my ears perked up on this comment. I've never served, but recall that incident very clearly.


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[Devious187]

Canada are some badass soldiers,small unit or not..They can fuck shit up.

[gutro]

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Ya, there's something wrong with my PM's..... Scott is looking into it.

[theshoebox]

Useless post.

[gutro]

Soooo.... let me get this straight. If the states is in a fight we have to stay until the states say, we're done here? Why does the US decided when, where and how long the fight should last?

Let me make one thing clear, i'm all for sticking around for the fight. I don't like the idea of us pulling out. What I have an issue with is the attitude of "THE US MAKES ALL THE RULES AND IF YOU DON'T LIKE IT, FUCK YOU. YOU'RE WORTHLESS."

I hate to say it, but it's that attitude that makes a lot of countries hesitate to support the US in the first place.

[robertjordan21]

listen i really dont want to bash on canada but come on this is bullshit....... its not until canada gets attacked that then they will actually send troops. I have no idea where canada's head is at but we are all brothers in the same cause and yet they dont see it that way. we'll just throw some troops there way and that will keep them happy and off our backs. Pisses me off so fucking hardcore. If canada was attacked you bet your ass we would be soo far up the other countries ass that attacked you they would be seeing uncle sam for the next 100 years. So grow up guys and join your brothers in this fight.

[gutro]

As I said above, I don't want us to pull out. I think we should be in there. Our politicians are fucking spineless when it comes to foreign affairs.

However, I don't think Canada, or any other nation for that matter, subject their resources to something they don't want to, just because Uncle Sam said so. If Canada had the funding for our Forces that the US did, and the man power, i'm sure we'd still be there and everywhere else.

[Ripcord]

listen i really dont want to bash on Canada but come on this is bullshit....... its not until Canada gets attacked that then they will actually send troops. I have no idea where Canada's head is at but we are all brothers in the same cause and yet they dont see it that way.

It's a sad sad day when a Canadian has to teach an American Americas history.
ever hear of a little conflict went by the name of WWII ?
America out right refused to join the War...until they were attacked at Pearl Harbor.
look at your own countries history before reprimanding us from your high horse.

you can sit and point fingers all you want and say shame on you..but in the end it is not the Soldier that makes the decisions when and where to fight.
keep that in mind.

[gutro]

It's a sad sad day when a Canadian has to teach an American Americas history.
ever hear of a little conflict went by the name of WWII ?
America out right refused to join the War...until they were attacked at Pearl Harbor.
look at your own countries history before reprimanding us from your high horse.

you can sit and point fingers all you want and say shame on you..but in the end it is not the Soldier that makes the decisions when and where to fight.
keep that in mind.

I couldn't have said it any better Ripcord! Unfortunately, a lot of Americans (not so much on here) but other places I socialize (global networks) have a one sided view on history that has them look down on Canada.

Fortunately, the majority of those American's who Actually serve or have served with Canadian Forces, support us and give us the credit we deserve.

[S19E5A1]

Good for them, no need to jump on the bandwagon because others are, stay true to the will of your people and your countries values. I wish our troops would come home :(

[Toki]

Do let me catch you trolling here either.

[MetaliCanuck]

All the so called wannabe US Force members on here spitting on anything Canadian are the same old QUIET fuckers I see in Ft Bragg, Blackwater etc when we are training their or they are up here training. Talk is cheap. Mick your obviously a retard whos never served a fucking day in your life and spends too much time on a pc.